Nan:2025-05-05-lcc-mass-deletion-nomod-2025
From Usenet Big-8 Management Board
From: Usenet Big-8 Management Board <board@big-8.org>
Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups,news.groups.proposals,news.groups
Subject: 3rd RFD: Mass-deletion of moderated groups without a moderator (LAST
CALL FOR COMMENTS)
Followup-To: news.groups.proposals
Date: Mon, 5 May 2025 13:52:41 EDT
Message-ID: <vvatp0$ilh$1@reader1.panix.com>
Archive-Name: mass-deletion-nomod-2025
REQUEST FOR DISCUSSION (RFD)
This is a formal Request for Discussion (RFD) to remove the following
89 moderated newsgroups.
The Big-8 Management Board plans to begin voting on this proposal
after five days. Please offer any final discussion or comments before
the end of this waiting period. Voting may take up to one week (seven
days); a result will be posted following the end of the voting period.
RATIONALE:
Currently, these groups cannot be used for discussion because of the
lack of a moderator. Most of these groups haven't had a moderator for
a long time and have been unused for years. We consider it unlikely
that they will ever be revived with a new moderator. Nonetheless,
anyone interested in becoming a moderator for a group listed in this
RFD is invited to contact the Big-8 Management Board.
DISCUSSION SO FAR:
The following summary collates discussion from various venues,
including news.groups.proposals, news.groups, news.admin.misc, and
e-mails to the Big-8 Management Board.
On changing the moderation flag for the groups:
noel, Christian Schumacher, Vasos Panagiotopoulos,
vjp2.at@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com, and Dan Cross argued for having
at least some groups' moderation flags unset rather than deleting the
groups. Ivo Gandolfo countered that many servers would not properly
apply the change in moderation flag.
On making it easier to find active groups:
Marco Moock said that cleaning up unused groups will make it easier
for users to find active groups; he acknowledged that some servers
don't process control articles but wondered why he should care about
these servers. Julien ÉLIE said that people will appreciate a
cleaned-up newsgroups list and that it doesn't matter if some servers
don't process the control articles. Julius Bernotas said that groups
should be deleted when they no longer fulfill their purpose.
Jean-Paul agreed with Marco that cleaning up unused groups will make
it easier for users to find active groups. Christian Schumacher said
that he looks for newsgroups by name, not by traffic.
noel argued that deleting a few hundred groups will not make it
significantly easier to find active groups. Julien ÉLIE agreed and
said that unmoderated groups should also be cleaned up.
On the distribution of the RFD:
Adam H. Kerman said that the RFD was not being distributed widely
enough, including to potential moderators of the specific groups in
the RFD. To the argument that removing unused groups makes active
groups easier to find, he responded that users can find these via
keyword search and by attempting to post to them. D expressed "no
objections your honour" to the RFD, later noting that 10% of currently
active newsgroups are moderated, but that the remaining 90%
unmoderated active newsgroups are overrun by trolls and spam. Paul
Schleck suggested a mechanism for crossposting a pointer to RFD to the
affected groups.
As a result of this discussion, the Board posted targeted pointers to
the RFD in groups topically related to each one under discussion --
see the section DISTRIBUTION below.
On losing the history associated with the groups:
Steve Bonine warned that when groups are removed, the history
associated with the contents of the group will disappear, which could
hinder people doing (historical) research. He agreed that removing
the unused groups in the RFD would prevent users from wasting their
time posting into the void, but said that at this time it's not worth
the effort to delete them. Winston and Keith Thompson shared Steve
Bonine's concern about the contents of deleted groups disappearing.
Computer Nerd Kev said that converting the groups to unmoderated ones
may work around this problem.
As a result of these discussions, Tristan Miller polled admins in
news.admin.misc about how they handle rmgroup control messages and
whether they retain postings in deleted groups. Ivo Gandolfo
responded that he manually reviews most control messages, and for
rmgroup messages simply converts the group to read-only. Thomas
Hochstein responded that rmgroup messages are processed automatically
by removing the group and all its posts. Thomas Hochstein and Julien
ÉLIE indicated that servers set up as archival will not honour rmgroup
messages and will not expire articles.
On using a robomoderator to auto-approve posts:
Rayner Lucas raised the possibility of placing some of the affected
groups under automated robo-moderation, as a temporary measure. D
Finnigan posted in support of this idea. Paul Schleck and noel
expressed concerns that this could lead to auto-approval of spam or
off-topic/illegal material, and therefore that setting this up would
be too much effort for little reward.
On specific groups:
Computer Nerd Kev pointed out that rec.arts.movies.reviews has seen
recent activity and sees a chance to revive it. (The Board
subsequently investigated this and confirmed that the group has no
moderation address registered; the sole active poster, who they were
unable to reach for comment, seems to be circumventing this by posting
articles with an Approved header to a lenient server.) The Board also
received an e-mail from someone volunteering to moderate
soc.genealogy.surnames.britain and is currently in correspondence with
them. In light of these developments, rec.arts.movies.reviews and
soc.genealogy.surnames.britain were excluded from the 2nd RFD.
vjp2.at@at.BioStrategist.dot.dot.com, Marco Moock, and Dan Cross
suggested converting comp.soft-sys.math.mathematica to an unmoderated
group. It is therefore excluded from the LCC.
Keith Thompson suggested that retaining comp.lang.c.moderated in order
to preserve its posting history and/or to revive the group, provided
there were enough demand. Keith Thompson contacted the previous
moderator of comp.lang.c.moderated, who confirmed that he is too busy
to resume moderating the group but is willing to hand it over to
another moderator. Keith indicated that he would be willing to
somehow help out with a revived group, and referred to discussions on
comp.lang.c where other posters expressed interest in participating.
Richard Heathfield likewise expressed interest. Dan Cross opined that
the group should either be given a new moderator or deleted.
comp.lang.c.moderated is therefore excluded from the LCC.
Keith Thompson suggested retaining rec.humor.funny. Rayner Lucas
contacted the most recent moderators, one of whom replied to express
interest in keeping that group and/or rec.humor.funny.reruns going.
Rayner Lucas and Tristan Miller both offered help with this.
rec.humor.funny and rec.humor.funny.reruns are therefore excluded from
the LCC.
Florian Rehnisch indicated that comp.binaries.cbm would not be a big
loss since the vast majority of Commodore binaries are archived on the
web. Tristan Miller reported that someone has now volunteered to
moderate the group, and that the current moderator has consented to
the handover. comp.binaries.cbm is therefore excluded from the LCC.
Ivan Shmakov expressed interest in moderating comp.newprod,
comp.std.announce, rec.photo.moderated, and comp.simulation, and in
participating in rec.arts.ascii, sci.bio.evolution,
sci.bio.phytopathology, sci.chem.organic.synthesis, soc.politics, and
soc.politics.marxism, were they to be somehow revived. Ivan also
noted that soc.politics has been active recently, albeit with a forged
Approved header. comp.newprod, comp.std.announce,
rec.photo.moderated, and comp.simulation are therefore excluded from
the LCC.
tidux expressed interest in robomoderating rec.arts.anime.creative,
and so it is excluded from the LCC.
DISTRIBUTION:
news.announce.newgroups
news.groups.proposals
news.groups
Targeted notices of this proposal were also posted in groups topically
related to each one under discussion, such as its parent group, its
sibling *.misc group, and/or the *.misc group of some other ancestor.
PROCEDURE:
The Big-8 Management Board plans to begin voting on this proposal
after five days. If there are specific reasons to vote individually
for some groups, the Board will do so, but the default will be a
ballot covering all groups.
Please offer any final discussion or comments in the moderated group
news.groups.proposals before the end of this waiting period. Voting
may take up to one week (seven days); a result will be posted
following the end of the voting period.
More details can be found here:
https://www.big-8.org/wiki/Mass_removal_of_groups
NEWSGROUP LINES:
comp.doc.techreports Lists of technical reports. (Moderated)
comp.internet.library Discussing electronic libraries. (Moderated)
comp.org.cauce The Coalition Against Unsolicited Commercial
E-Mail. (Moderated)
comp.robotics.research Academic, government & industry research in
robotics. (Moderated)
comp.sources.games Postings of recreational software. (Moderated)
comp.sys.amiga.announce Announcements about the Amiga. (Moderated)
comp.sys.sun.announce Sun announcements and Sunergy mailings. (Moderated)
humanities.philosophy.objectivism The ideas of Ayn Rand. (Moderated)
misc.activism.progressive Information for Progressive activists.
(Moderated)
misc.business.consulting The business of consulting. (Moderated)
misc.business.marketing.moderated Roundtable for marketing topics.
(Moderated)
misc.business.moderated Roundtable for general business topics. (Moderated)
misc.entrepreneurs.moderated Entrepreneur/business topics. (Moderated)
misc.invest.financial-plan Financial planning in general. (Moderated)
misc.transport.air-industry Airlines, airports, commercial aircraft.
(Moderated)
misc.writing.screenplays.moderated Craft/business of screenwriting.
(Moderated)
news.admin.net-abuse.policy Discussion of net abuse policy. (Moderated)
news.announce.conferences Calls for papers and conferences.
(Moderated)
rec.arts.anime.info Announcements about Japanese animation. (Moderated)
rec.arts.ascii ASCII art, info on archives, art, & artists.
(Moderated)
rec.arts.drwho.moderated Discussion of "Doctor Who". (Moderated)
rec.arts.erotica Erotic fiction and verse. (Moderated)
rec.arts.movies.erotica Aspects of erotic films and videos. (Moderated)
rec.arts.sf.announce Major announcements of the SF world. (Moderated)
rec.arts.sf.starwars.info General information pertaining to Star
Wars. (Moderated)
rec.autos.sport.f1.moderated Discussion of Formula One racing.
(Moderated)
rec.autos.sport.nascar.moderated NASCAR and Stockcar Racing.
(Moderated)
rec.boats.marketplace Boating products for sale and wanted. (Moderated)
rec.crafts.jewelry Jewelry making and gemology. (Moderated)
rec.drugs.announce Announcements about drugs and related issues.
(Moderated)
rec.food.cuisine.jewish All matters concerning Jewish cuisine. (Moderated)
rec.food.recipes Recipes for interesting food and drink. (Moderated)
rec.gardens.ecosystems Ecosystems and organic gardening. (Moderated)
rec.martial-arts.moderated Martial-arts in general. (Moderated)
rec.music.beatles.info Latest press notes about the Beatles. (Moderated)
rec.music.beatles.moderated Fab Four analytical & investigative
articles. (Moderated)
rec.music.gaffa Discussion of Kate Bush & other alternative
music. (Moderated)
rec.music.info News and announcements on musical topics.
(Moderated)
rec.music.makers.guitar.tablature Guitar tablature and
performance. (Moderated)
rec.music.promotional Information and promo materials from record
companies. (Moderated)
rec.music.reviews Reviews of music of all genres and mediums.
(Moderated)
rec.pets.dogs.info General information and FAQs posted here.
(Moderated)
rec.pets.ferrets Forum on ferret care and husbandry. (Moderated)
rec.skiing.alpine.moderated Alpine (downhill) skiing. (Moderated)
rec.skiing.announce FAQ, competition results, automated snow
reports. (Moderated)
sci.aeronautics The science of aeronautics & related technology.
(Moderated)
sci.archaeology.moderated All aspects of archaeology. (Moderated)
sci.bio.evolution Discussions of evolutionary biology. (Moderated)
sci.bio.phytopathology All aspects of plant diseases and pests. (Moderated)
sci.chem.organic.synthesis Synthetic organic chemistry related
topics. (Moderated)
sci.econ.research Research in all fields of economics. (Moderated)
sci.med.orthopedics Orthopedic Surgery, related issues and
management. (Moderated)
sci.military.moderated Military technology. (Moderated)
sci.nanotech Self-reproducing molecular-scale machines.
(Moderated)
sci.physics.foundations Fundamental and philosophical physics. (Moderated)
sci.physics.strings String theory and related fields. (Moderated)
sci.space.moderated Discussions about space related topics. (Moderated)
sci.space.news Announcements of space-related news items.
(Moderated)
soc.adoption.adoptees Discussion of adoption by adoptees. (Moderated)
soc.atheism Living as an atheist and atheism in society.
(Moderated)
soc.culture.african.american.moderated African-American perspectives.
(Moderated)
soc.culture.basque Basque culture and related issues. (Moderated)
soc.culture.belarus All things about Belarus. (Moderated)
soc.culture.hawaii Aloha kakou, E KOMO MAI! Eh, no forget hemo da
shoes. (Moderated)
soc.culture.indian.goa About Goa, India's smallest state. (Moderated)
soc.culture.jewish.parenting Issues about raising Jewish children.
(Moderated)
soc.culture.kuwait.moderated Kuwaiti culture, society, and history.
(Moderated)
soc.culture.turkish.moderated Issues related to Turks/Turkey. (Moderated)
soc.feminism Discussion of feminism & feminist issues.
(Moderated)
soc.genealogy.african Genealogy of Africa and the African Diaspora.
(Moderated)
soc.genealogy.surnames.canada Surnames queries - Canada. (Moderated)
soc.genealogy.surnames.german Surnames queries - German speaking
countries. (Moderated)
soc.genealogy.surnames.global Surnames queries central database.
(Moderated)
soc.genealogy.surnames.misc Surnames - regions not covered
elsewhere. (Moderated)
soc.genealogy.surnames.usa Surnames queries - USA. (Moderated)
soc.history.moderated All aspects of history. (Moderated)
soc.personals Personal ads -- people in search of (ISO)
others. (Moderated)
soc.politics Political problems, systems, solutions. (Moderated)
soc.politics.marxism Karl Marx and his legacy in theory and practice.
(Moderated)
soc.religion.asatru Following the Gods and Goddesses of Northern
Europe. (Moderated)
soc.religion.bahai Discussion of the Baha'i Faith. (Moderated)
soc.religion.hindu Discussion about the Hindu dharma, philosophy,
culture. (Moderated)
soc.religion.mormon The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
(Moderated)
soc.religion.paganism Networking for Pagans. (Moderated)
soc.religion.unitarian-univ Unitarian-Universalism & non-creedal
religions. (Moderated)
soc.sexuality.spanking Adult sexual spanking. (Moderated)
soc.support.fat-acceptance.moderated Self-acceptance for fat people.
(Moderated)
soc.support.loneliness Mutual help and chat for those of us who feel
alone. (Moderated)
soc.support.youth.gay-lesbian-bi Gay youths helping each other.
(Moderated)
If you have any objections, please make them heard in moderated group
news.groups.proposals. The "Followup-To:" header is set on this message,
so simply replying to this post should do the right thing.
HISTORY OF THIS RFD:
2025-01-03: 1st RFD (remove)
2025-02-02: 2nd RFD (remove)
rec.arts.movies.reviews excluded
soc.genealogy.surnames.britain excluded
2025-03-11: 3rd RFD (remove)
2025-05-05: Final RFD / Last Call for Comments
comp.binaries.cbm excluded
comp.lang.c.moderated excluded
comp.newprod excluded
comp.simulation excluded
comp.soft-sys.math.mathematica excluded
comp.std.announce excluded
rec.arts.anime.creative excluded
rec.humor.funny excluded
rec.humor.funny.reruns excluded
rec.photo.moderated excluded
--
Usenet Big-8 Management Board
https://www.big-8.org/
board@big-8.org
