https://www.big-8.org/w/index.php?action=history&feed=atom&title=Nan%3A2007-08-02-news.groups.removals-lccNan:2007-08-02-news.groups.removals-lcc - Revision history2026-04-30T04:11:17ZRevision history for this page on the wikiMediaWiki 1.43.1https://www.big-8.org/w/index.php?title=Nan:2007-08-02-news.groups.removals-lcc&diff=942&oldid=prevMoleski: Created page with '<pre> From: The Big-8 Management Board <board@big-8.org> Subject: 2nd RFD: news.groups.removals (LAST CALL FOR COMMENTS) Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups, news.groups, news.gr…'2010-07-10T02:10:02Z<p>Created page with '<pre> From: The Big-8 Management Board <board@big-8.org> Subject: 2nd RFD: news.groups.removals (LAST CALL FOR COMMENTS) Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups, news.groups, news.gr…'</p>
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From: The Big-8 Management Board <board@big-8.org><br />
Subject: 2nd RFD: news.groups.removals (LAST CALL FOR COMMENTS)<br />
Newsgroups: news.announce.newgroups, news.groups, news.groups.proposals<br />
Followup-To: news.groups.proposals<br />
Date: Thu, 02 Aug 2007 15:28:43 -0500<br />
Organization: http://www.big-8.org/<br />
<br />
REQUEST FOR DISCUSSION (RFD)<br />
news.groups.removals<br />
<br />
This is a formal Request For Discussion (RFD) for the creation of the<br />
unmoderated Usenet newsgroup, news.groups.removals.<br />
<br />
<br />
PROCEDURE:<br />
<br />
The B8MB plans to begin voting on this proposal after five days. Please<br />
offer any final discussion or comments before the end of this waiting<br />
period. Voting may take up to one week (7 days); a result will be posted<br />
following the end of the voting period.<br />
<br />
All discussion of this proposal should be posted to news.groups.proposals.<br />
<br />
The full group creation procedure is documented here:<br />
<br />
http://www.big-8.org/dokuwiki/doku.php?id=policies:proposals<br />
<br />
<br />
<br />
NEWSGROUPS LINE: news.groups.removals<br />
<br />
news.groups.removals Discussion of<br />
proposed newsgroup removals.<br />
<br />
<br />
SUMMARY OF DISCUSSION:<br />
<br />
Most of the discussion was whether news.groups would be sufficient for<br />
the purpose of discussing removal of unmoderated newsgroups rather<br />
than creation of a news.groups.removals.<br />
<br />
First it should be understood that the intent is that any discussion<br />
occur in the group that might be removed. In many cases, there may be<br />
no discussion. But when there is discussion, the discussion itself<br />
would give additional notice to any lurkers who did not see any of the<br />
three RFD's or ignored them.<br />
<br />
The cross-post to news.groups.removals would provide a common place to<br />
observe the discussion. It is fully expected that the B8MB will also<br />
observe any discussion that occurs solely in the groups proposed for<br />
removal.<br />
<br />
It does not matter whether news.groups.removals exists on the server<br />
where a reader of the low-traffic group posts. A cross-posted article<br />
will propagate.<br />
<br />
There would be problems if the moderated news.groups.proposals was<br />
used, or if news.groups.removals were moderated.<br />
<br />
This proposal would move newsgroup removal discussion from<br />
news.groups.proposals where it is currently held to<br />
news.groups.removals. It would be confusing to move some discussion<br />
of news groups changes back to news.groups.<br />
<br />
<br />
RATIONALE: news.groups.removals<br />
<br />
This proposed newsgroup is complementary to implementation of the<br />
proposed policy for removing extremely low-traffic unmoderated<br />
newsgroups that is currently being discussed in news.groups.proposals.<br />
<br />
When a newsgroup is proposed for removal, it is an imperative that any<br />
users of the newsgroup have the opportunity to discuss and understand<br />
the reasons for removal, to object to the group's removal, or to<br />
propose alternatives to removal.<br />
<br />
Currently, discussion of newsgroup removals occurs in<br />
news.groups.proposals (NGP), a moderated newsgroup. If NGP does not<br />
exist on a particular user's news server, then it is difficult, if not<br />
impossible for the user to submit their articles for approval.<br />
Further, some objections removing a newsgroup may not satisfy NGP<br />
standards of civility. If someone fears that "their group" is about<br />
to be removed, they may not express their opinion in the most polite<br />
manner, but they should not be excluded from the discussion.<br />
<br />
An unmoderated newsgroup, news.groups.removals, addresses these two<br />
issues. As an unmoderated newsgroup, articles would not need to be<br />
approved. In addition, discussion will be cross-posted between<br />
news.groups.removals and the candidate group for removal. This will<br />
ensure propagation of articles, even if news.groups.removals does not<br />
exist on some news servers. The cross-posting of the discussion to<br />
the candidate group will maximize visibility of a proposed newsgroup<br />
removal.<br />
<br />
While there is less utility in having an unmoderated management group<br />
for discussion of a proposed removal of a moderated newsgroup,<br />
news.groups.removals will be used for such proposals to avoid<br />
confusion over the name or which group is to be used.<br />
<br />
While the unmoderated newsgroup news.groups could also serve the role,<br />
I think it is preferable to have a newsgroup for specific proposed<br />
removals that parallels the use of news.groups.proposals. news.groups<br />
would continue to be used for more general discussion about<br />
newsgroups, including overall policy issues, etc.<br />
<br />
<br />
CHARTER:<br />
<br />
The newsgroup news.groups.removals is used for discussion of proposed<br />
removal of specific Big-8 newsgroups. Only removals that have been<br />
formally proposed in news.announce.newgroups shall be discussed.<br />
<br />
Discussion relating to policies regarding newsgroup removals,<br />
tentative discussion of potential newsgroup removals, etc. should<br />
occur in news.groups.<br />
<br />
Discussion relating to newsgroup removals that are part of a larger<br />
re-organization should be posted in news.groups.proposals. The<br />
moderators of news.groups.proposals may approve cross-posts to<br />
news.groups.removals about those parts of a re-organization that<br />
relate specifically to the removal of a newsgroup.<br />
<br />
Discussion about the removal of a specific unmoderated newsgroup<br />
should be cross-posted between the newsgroup proposed for removal and<br />
news.groups.removals. RFD's proposing removals should set the<br />
Followup-To header to news.groups.removals and the group proposed for<br />
removal. Other relevant newsgroups may be included in the cross-post.<br />
<br />
Discussion about the removal of a specific moderated newsgroup should<br />
be posted to news.groups.removals. Other relevant newsgroups may be<br />
included in a cross-post.<br />
<br />
<br />
<br />
<br />
<br />
DISTRIBUTION:<br />
<br />
This document has been posted to the following newsgroups:<br />
<br />
news.announce.newgroups (moderated)<br />
news.groups.proposals (moderated)<br />
news.groups<br />
<br />
<br />
PROPONENT:<br />
<br />
Jim Riley <jimrtex@pipeline.com><br />
<br />
<br />
<br />
CHANGE HISTORY:<br />
<br />
2007-06-28 1st RFD<br />
2007-08-05 2nd RFD/LCC<br />
</pre></div>Moleski